Eldrad Is Joining WOSH
Facing multiple land raider and Vulkan spam is now a fact where I play, and now that the guard ‘dex is out and has been wargamed a bit people have “discovered” that an armored company build rocks best- there is a reason GW got rid of it the first time around- nice job GW for bringing it back in regular 40K game. I figure I have a few more months at best before dudes finish selling their salamanders army for armored company…
The key for me with mech eldar is to stay alive- holo-fields and energy shields used to cut it, now I need cover saves more and more against all these tanks with multiple shots, sponsors, etc. Recent tourney where I took second place really was one of those moments of enlightenment for me…
It was an odd mix of bonus points and 4th edition missions where troops didn’t really mean much and I needed to contest table quarters. This means no real shooting but rather zipping around with my tanks. My fire prism (pictured below) took multiple krak missile hits from twenty terminators, three las cannons hits, and an occasional melta shot from the speeders each turn. Now true I was making mad cover saves that day- my dice were on fire, but it was unreal and very frustrating to my opponents- just the type of thing I like…
The key for me with mech eldar is to stay alive- holo-fields and energy shields used to cut it, now I need cover saves more and more against all these tanks with multiple shots, sponsors, etc. Recent tourney where I took second place really was one of those moments of enlightenment for me…
It was an odd mix of bonus points and 4th edition missions where troops didn’t really mean much and I needed to contest table quarters. This means no real shooting but rather zipping around with my tanks. My fire prism (pictured below) took multiple krak missile hits from twenty terminators, three las cannons hits, and an occasional melta shot from the speeders each turn. Now true I was making mad cover saves that day- my dice were on fire, but it was unreal and very frustrating to my opponents- just the type of thing I like…
So how does Eldrad work into this list? More and more my firepower is coming up short- it definitely does not match my arrogance to work in the quote, so I’m almost giving up on shooting completely and going for pure survivability- this means sticking Eldrad in a wave serpent for fortune tricks and x2 guides with the vypers in support around him, while my farseer in the council does her thing. Is this what armored spam is forcing me to do- run a deathstar Saim-Hann list?
Next game at the club I’m going to try and win the entire game by not firing a single shot to test my theory out.
14 comments:
Uh is it really so bad again?
Not very good to hear. Something else. I was wondering if you ever played a 12250 Points game you versus the 7 other races(basically 7). That is Chaos, SM, Imperium, Orks, Tau, Necrons, Tyranids. Basically the others are from the same "nation" if you want so. I was just listining to this awesome song cover I think of the White Stripes "7 Nation Army. If you give it a try in youtube you might know what I mean.
Eldrad can't Fortune from the Wave Serpent, can he? I believe a vehicle needs fire points to be able to use psychic powers from inside (you can use powers on the squad that is inside the tank with him).
Please correct me if I'm wrong, I would hate for you to take that to a tourney only to find out there that you can't use it.
Good luck.
Page 66, little rulebook, Fire points:
A transport vehicle may have a number of fire points defined in its entry. A fire point is a hatch or gun slit form which one or more passengers inside the vehicle can fire (or use a psychic power).
The million dollar question is: Do they mean a psychic shooting attack, or psychic powers in general?
This FAQ isn't crystal clear:
http://www.games-workshop.com/MEDIA_CustomProductCatalog/m2030054_40k_Rulebook_March_2009.pdf
But it does suggest that if it shoots, it uses a fire point, otherwise *not*. Hence, Mr Fritz can power away to his hearts content, as long as it is not shooting stuff.
Caveat: I can read English, but I am not a GW rule interpreter with connections directly to the Emperor...
i don't think the farseer needs firing points to use doom, fortune, or guide. the codex only says a target model has to be within a certain range, never stating LOS is necessary.
Mind war definitely needs LOS so probably can't be used from a WS b/c of the lack of firing points.
Storm might be usable b/c it never states you need LOS.
on the basis of what's been said i'd agree, but towards the end of the FAQ there is this entry:
Q. Can Psychic powers be used on a unit embarked on a transport?
A. For simplicity’s sake, the answer has to be a firm ‘No, unless the psyker himself is in the unit being transported’.
it would be fair to argue that if you cant cast from outside to inside you cant do the opposite either.
It also seems very sketchy if the entire tactical makeup of your army rests solely on one tenuous rule interpretation. Thats leaving a little too much to chance and shady morality for me.
That FAQ line is about the reverse of the situation, casting upon a unit with no models on the table, not the casting from within.
So your obstacles are:
Is a psyker allowed to use psychic powers from within transports?
Yes. Plenty of examples there, including the very same FAQ line allowing a psyker to cast upon the unit in there with him.
How do you measure range for powers from transports?
Also plenty of examples where the hull of a transport is used for all sorts of special abilities, like Chaos Icons, IG Orders, Locator Beacons, etc.
Is the target on the table and within range of the hull for the psychic power to work?
If it's a unit outside the vehicle, then yes. You can measure distance. If it's a model inside another transport, fall back to the FAQ as there is no model on the table. No other precedents support affecting a unit inside a vehicle, even an open topped one.
Ill test that theory Fritz!
that the models arent "on the table" is irrelevant, for the purposes of the game they're within the transport. so the rule prevents you casting thru the hull of the transport upon 'the models inside'.
we'll need a better example than the one from the FAQ, as that isnt passing thru the hull of the transport. it's from within to within. and dont IG orders require the 'command vehicle' rule?
Again, read the relevant FAQ and Codex.
From the Main 40k Rulebook FAQ.
Q. Can a model use a psychic power that is not a Psychic Shooting Attack if it is embarked in a transport vehicle?
A. Yes. If the power requires line of sight, this is still worked out from the vehicle’s fire points (this will count as one model shooting through that fire point if the power is used in the Shooting phase).
If the psychic power does not require line of sight and has a range or an area of effect that is
normally measured from the model using it, these are measured from the vehicle’s hull, as explained in the Embarking section on page 66.
Clear enough for you, now?
Fortune
* Needs line of sight? Nope. (Codex: Eldar)
* Needs firing point? Nope. (FAQ)
* Model in range of Hull? Yep. (FAQ, BRB)
= Successful cast.
Guide
* Needs line of sight? Nope. (Codex: Eldar)
* Needs firing point? Nope. (FAQ)
* Model in range of Hull? Yep. (FAQ, BRB)
= Successful cast.
Nothing tenuous about it.
Nicely put Kizyc, I run a Yme-Loc tank heavy Eldar list of 3 wave serpents 2 fire prisms and 1 falcon. Having had to FAQ the rules many times for it to people in much the same way you did... I look forward on seeing the battle report Fritz...
aye, don't think there's any room for doubt as to whether it's legal now. :)
do you guys know if a farseer can cast fortune on himself right before coming on to the board from reserve?
he cant. he has to be on the board to cast it and isnt on the board till the movement phase, after he would have to have cast it.
Post a Comment